Wylderkin racial choices

I remember sitting around with the plot team once (late hours of the night when we were just waiting for a few stragglers to come in before shutting down) discussing what types of kyn felt like they could justify the Resist Dodge / Resist Magic combo.

We came up with: Butterflykyn

Dodge is sorta self evident and butterflies have something of "magical" appearance / essence. They are the kind of creatures you expect to see with sparkles around them. Is it perfect? No, but no racials are perfect when discussing kyn.

I mostly find it amusing how different a thought process this plot team had than the previous poster who insists that Resist Magic only belongs on a "rugged" creature (I wouldn't call Dark Elves rugged, personally).

So, yeah, I can see the problem that different plot teams would approve different things. Personally, I think that since any combo should be potentially legal, it is the duty of a plot team to offer a choice / background /etc that would allow a specific combination if the team initially disagrees with the player request.

-MS
 
I've changed my mind.

My primary reason for Resist Magic not being appropriate as a Kyn Racial is that the rationale for it's justification never suspended my disbelief, so it always felt cheesy. Just like any Kyn with racial abilities that didn't make sense to their animal type, they always felt cheesy to me (Racoon with a Slay?! What?). I also have a problem that I prefer to think inside the box (and disliking most things outside the box). But, I have changed my mind. I don't care anymore. Go hog wild (see what I did there?) with the Slothkyn who has Resist Magic and Dodge! Validate that Rabbitkyn with Racial Prof and Resist Necromancy! Rock that Anglerfishkyn with Gypsy Curse and Resist Binding!

Why? Because in the grand scheme of things the only logical sense is balance. The whole game is one big exercise at the suspension of disbelief, so if you can suspend your disbelief that the guy over there with rabbit ears on his head is actually an anthropomorphic rabbit, then you can believe that anthropomorphic rabbit may have some traits one would not see on a little fuzzy rabbit. The Racial Abilities are relatively balanced against each other as far as cost and amounts that can be purchased; so, like Dan effectively said, worrying about it may be unnecessary energy spent.
 
Tough topic... because so many take myths/literary symbolism about different kinds of animals as gospel, where the natural reality may be vastly different, or way more complicated that someone suspects... but either interpretation seems pretty open to use for character refference, wich is kinda good and bad because that leaves open lots of opportunity for different kind of personalities even within one species But some things are hugely way outside people's expectations based on stereotype so theres a chance for a lot of argument of whats right or what isnt for abilities for a given game.

Example: deer... they can actually be pretty mean, moms are REALLY mean, deer in general kill a lot of people every year (more than sharks worldwide), and evidently WILL eat live birds if given the chance. (watch at own risk) ... and yet usually they are thought of as flightly passive herbivors a-la bambi or sometimes symbols of righteous nobility, or peace or serenity... soo... I dunno. Good rule of thumb I go with? if it dosnt sound dumb to most people looking it over and the rational behind it is not long and convoluted, its probably gonna be ok : )
 
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One thing about the make up and prosthetic requirement. For getting two racial "choices" (quotes due it being logical for the kin) there is a TON of really cheesy kin out there that you have no idea what they are and do minimal work. Sorry, if you have less going on than a human I feel like you're just making it up as you go to get the benefits. Not saying you have to spend a billion dollars or go full on. But heck, if your kin has stripes, please put stripes on your face. If you have fur, PLEASE TRY TO HAVE SOME SORT OF FUR TAIL, EARS, SOMETHING! And don't be offended when I ask what the heck you are. It is my biggest pet peeve in the game because of the two racial picks.

As for resist magic. I believe the land has magic and with spell snd rituals all around. And the infamous "HOLD. YOU FEEL MAGIC ALL AROUND YOU". Some races should be able to be like "eh, shrug off cause I feel magic all the time". Example my friend plays a crow-kin and her backstory is she was outside a dark elven cave and was friends with a dark elf caster (almost like a sorceress and a pet crow type deal) so she has resist magic since she's been around magic quite a lot.

Also. Deer are nasty mean animals.

I mean resisting necromancy is a greater feat in my book that resisting magic. Like how often are you surrounded by necromancy!? If you're a good hearted pc, not often. My coyote has resist necro because I said Coyotes eat some nasty things and don't fall ill. (Granted this is when I first started playing) but now I know more, I feel resist necro is hard to justify.

Also I don't know how a kin can have gypsy curse? Justify that cause I can't unless it's a backstory type deal.
 
And to add cause I feel like my post almost double standard. Resist magic- though I mention back story I mainly wanted to point out that the crow was surrounded by magic. Which is all around the land anyways.

Gypsy curse- only gypsy do curses so it would be all backstory or no dice
 
(Edit: Never mind!)
 
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Tantarus said:
I have to agree with evan in the other thread. It should not be open to interpenetration by each plot. It should be preset in the book, or just a free choice without needed to justify it. Otherwise it makes for issues when transferring possibly, issues with favoritism perhaps, and other such issues. Such as someone with a good mind for debate might get something passed that a newer player could not. Which is hardly fair, imo.
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Agreed. Nowhere else in the system do you have to justify your build expenditures to any given plot team, same should go for Kin.

Tantarus said:
That is a good question, raised by gypsies equals taking gypsy curse racial?
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Is there where I note again that Gypsy and Barbarian should just be Humans with culture packs? :p
 
Dan Nickname Beshers said:
I can certainly see where the aversion to Resist Magic in particular comes from since it's a trait that no real world animal exhibits, but isn't that also true about Resist Command, or Resist Necromancy?
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Mulekin? For the resist command, (not the necro) because they're stubborn.
 
I have a rabbit Kin with Resist Magic and Gypsy Curse somewhere on paper.

He also has one foot.

If I wasn't trying -not- to deal with vast makeup issues right now I'd probably play him.
 
Muir said:
Agreed. Nowhere else in the system do you have to justify your build expenditures to any given plot team, same should go for Kin.
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You aren't justifying your build expenditures. You are justifying the racial advantages of your "build your own race" character. Every race ever made had its advantages justified. The process just involved more people and the templates created were permanent. In fact, in that way, specific Wylderkin building is somewhat similar. If you work with plot to create the Boarkin template, the next person who wants to play a Boarkin can use your template pretty much automatically, since it already approved that combination of advantages as reasonable for that type of Kin.

-MS
 
mikestrauss said:
If you work with plot to create the Boarkin template, the next person who wants to play a Boarkin can use your template pretty much automatically, since it already approved that combination of advantages as reasonable for that type of Kin.

-MS
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Unless the Plot team changed since the first player, then there's no guarantee. It's entirely possible that a new Plot team could disagree with the decision regarding the approval of the first Boarkyn template, and will refuse to approve the second.

Alternatively, a Plot team might say they'll only approve a Boarkyn with set racials, and for the duration of that Plot team, anyone wanting to play a Boarkyn must have those racials.

While these might be extreme examples, they're absolutely possible, under the RAW. And that shouldn't be possible.
 
Dan Nickname Beshers said:
I am famously stubborn. I don't know that that confers upon me the hypothetical ability to shrug off a magical compulsion to obey.
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I'm not saying that being stubborn should allow anyone to get resist command if they otherwise couldn't. I'm saying that I think a Mulekin should be able to get resist command because mules are known to be stubborn.
 
I don't mean to turn this into a back and forth bickering session, but do you see the (mild) hypocrisy there? Mules are known to be stubborn but not superhumanly stubborn, which is literally what racial skills are: things that your character's race does better than any human can. That's the definition of superhuman, and that's what the wylderkin are supposed to be drawing from: animal traits that exceed human capacity. Not just human norms, but human potential.
 
Dan Nickname Beshers said:
I don't mean to turn this into a back and forth bickering session, but do you see the (mild) hypocrisy there? Mules are known to be stubborn but not superhumanly stubborn, which is literally what racial skills are: things that your character's race does better than any human can. That's the definition of superhuman, and that's what the wylderkin are supposed to be drawing from: animal traits that exceed human capacity. Not just human norms, but human potential.
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I think the idea is that Kin are Humanoid (like human) but are more than just human. They are also animal like, but are more so. Not all animals have great sense of smell, but kin do. As such they may exaggerate the traits of the Animal they are similar to.

As had been said before, this is a world of magic. As you have said, its a magic compulsion (not always as the case of sleep gas poison). Real world animals do not have exposure to magic, Alliance animals do. Therefore, a Mulekin with resist command seems very appropriate.

When all said and done, PFM guys, PFM.
 
Sure. Maybe my point is being diluted by being spread out over multiple posts (and some unflagged devil's advocacy).

I don't think it's necessary to require players to get approval for wylderkin racial skills. I don't believe any of the racial skills are so powerful in a vacuum that access to any two of them is game breaking. I do believe that public opinion and peer pressure will stop people from trying to play a sponge-kin with Dodge and Resist Binding. Anyone who tries will be made aware that they're not doing it right, and they will not be so powerful compared to other characters that it ruins anyone's fun in the process. I therefore wanted to draw attention to the fact that Resist Magic in particular is set aside from the other skills as being unjustifiable and the province of cheesey power-twinking munch-kin communazis, and that I think that is unreasonable. Let the game be fun when that fun doesn't hurt anyone.
 
Draven said:
Unless the Plot team changed since the first player, then there's no guarantee. It's entirely possible that a new Plot team could disagree with the decision regarding the approval of the first Boarkyn template, and will refuse to approve the second.

Alternatively, a Plot team might say they'll only approve a Boarkyn with set racials, and for the duration of that Plot team, anyone wanting to play a Boarkyn must have those racials.

While these might be extreme examples, they're absolutely possible, under the RAW. And that shouldn't be possible.
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Exactly. Requiring specific plot team approval of this kind of thing is essentially creating LCO races, and LCO character cards given that other plot teams are allowed to deny racial choices if they so choose.

This is a Bad Thing (TM).
 
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