Religion

Golanth

Golanth

Newbie
Ok are there any races that do not under any circumstance have religion, and are any religions not allowed? In other words, is it possible for my character to worship Bahamut?
 
From what I understand, and I'm no rules marshall so take this with a grain of salt, religion does not exist in Alliance, so to answer your first question YES, all races, under no circumstances, have a religion.

That being said, I haven't heard or seen anything indicating that you cannot, through IC actions, create a religion, though that may come down to spirit of the rules.
 
Per the rules, the game does NOT have religion. There is no in-game religion and you can't create an in-game religion. It is a hard and fast rule. Sorry, there is no Bahamut to worship and you really can't make one up.

-MS
 
The more you know.
 
Yep, we even try to avoid religious iconography and such. Each chapter will have their own interpretation of what constitutes religion. Check with your local chapter if you think something is borderline.
 
"No worship" is the basic fundamental rule you can't break.

There are religious things in our game since we're fantasy based (after all, mythology is just religion no one believes any more). We have devil-like beings and angel-like beings and an afterlife and stuff like that.

The key is to avoid the rituals of religion -- no churches, no gods, no worship.
 
I had wondered, what if a character holds another creature in high esteem? Not worship per say, but does things in the name of say a dragon or fae? Or does offerings to said creatures? Is that a no go? Even if it is IG as the creature is played by an NPC? Example: offering an IG item to said creature everytime they come to town or daily? Or say bowing to every Elf because the powerful creature feels they are the epitome of beauty and deserve the respect?
Is it avoid all rituals that may seem like religion or just those established religions that could be offended if done incorrectly?
 
I think it requires a certain level of common sense and willingness to accept that what a person is doing is NOT worship. If you really wanted to make it an issue, it would be pretty easy to accept the reverence and deference that most kings require and receive in our game as "worship:" Their word is law, their every deed recorded, their every need catered to, their every whim a command.

It boils down to a willingness on the part of the players to accept arbitrary lines and work their actions out in such a way as to avoid conflict on the subject wherever possible. Don't wear a big red cross on your shield, don't call an icon a god, don't call the chanting necromancer with the bloody sacrificial dagger a "devil worshiper," and so on. Try not to shout "oh, Christ" when something hits you for 300 Massive.

Every one of your examples need to be individually decided on by your local plot team, and that's the fun scary part of the "no religion" rule.
 
Hey Norm, as long as you understand you're walking a very thin line there, and work with your plot team first, you'd likely be okay. It is a case where it is better to get permission than ask forgiveness, because we want happy friendy pretendy times, not people to feel excluded or have their real life religious beliefs insulted.
 
This is kind of the discussion I hoped to spark. I didn't plan to do this, but its necessary for completeness. Why should I ask plot to follow around a creature in awe, if that is my characters choice? I completely understand not using modern or even archaeic religions or their worship rituals or words special to them, as to not offend someone. We are all friends, if not, respectful of each others beliefs and customs. But I have seen this reverence and respect and awe used before. So I want to know, since it is not religion exactly, is it wrong to do? Should we as players reverse metagame and just not do it?
 
You should ask plot precisely because you aren't certain if you need to ask or not. Why risk offending or upsetting someone OOG otherwise?

It is clear from your wording that you personally don't feel like showing reverence in such a manner is outright worship. I suspect most people would agree with you. However, in a situation like this, where you know that there is a line not to cross but aren't sure where the line stands - it's better just to ask.

This thread, in particular, is probably not the place to do it. You will be able to conjure up an infinite parade of "but what if X? what if X and Y but not Z?" That's why the rule isn't a hard and fast one with clear delineation.
 
In case that answer didn't suffice, let me offer a different reasoning that comes to the same conclusion.

You are aware that there is a strict "no religion / worship" rule.

If you ask first, worst case scenario is plot tells you "no." You don't do it. No harm, no foul. In fact, there is a chance some plot member remembers and appreciates that you were cautious when faced with a situation where you could be in violation of an important rule.

If you don't ask first, the worst case scenario is that you receive a harsh punishment. The "I didn't think it would cross the line" defense doesn't work because you had ample opportunity to speak with someone on plot before acting that way.

The best case scenario in both situations is basically exactly the same. There really is no upside to not asking in advance. You could argue this could apply to almost any situation, but the majority of rules have no meaningful wiggle. You can't just decide to cast a fire bolt if you haven't memorized it or decide to ignore damage. Similarly, it is clear that you should contact staff if there is any reason that required medication might put you in an impaired state.

Basically, every rule of this sort has a built-in, act with caution and if you really want to skate the edge, speak with someone official first.

-MS
 
Correct Seth. what happens when that character crosses chapter lines? whats allowed at one chapter could be disallowed everywhere else. If it is no religion, then no religion If it is no worship of higher/powerful beings, then that should be included too.
 
As a rules marshal, I feel its important to get clear definitions out for players, new and old. I completely under stand asking plot, but there will be players who think "why do I have to ask plot? Its not a religion." There are many grey areas and tangent ideas attached to this topic that are common in the ARB, Barbarians belief about celestial magic, mentions of Shamans, which could be seen as religious or even derogatory in nature towards real life classes of people. But that horse has been beat in other threads.
I really want people to have a firm grasp on this so we dont have peoples feeling hurt.
 
I don't have a good answer. My opinion is that a person should ask themselves if what they are doing is too close to religion. If no, then proceed, and be open to someone asking you to not do it anymore.

There is so much in this game that could be misconstrued as religion we need to be able to (a) trust our players to do what is right and (b) ensure our players are flexible enough to change their behavior when asked should something cross a line.

Edit: I have been writing to much. Typo of "right" to "write".
 
this is one of the rules I break from time to time. In the real world I tend to mutter things under my breath like "oh for heaven's sake" or "sweet Jesus". I'm trying to break myself of those things by changing what I say. It's not like anyone has ever yelled at me for it, but I know it takes away from the fantasy of it all.
 
I find that for those types of things, using alternate but similar epithets to work. "Sweet Mercy" or "Oh reeally" work as substitutes.
 
I, too, have the problem is saying, "oh Christ" or something of the like. I am trying to swear in Sindarin instead but it's quite the process to break a habit that old.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top